Why Does Kenny G Drive Critics Crazy?

00:00:34 the elusive and contested. concept of a guilty pleasure.

He's just sort of part. of the musical furniture

of American culture.

It's just wallpaper.

With Kenny G's music, what can you say?

Kenny G, the curly-maned saxophonist

who has sold 75 million. records and inspired

the entire genre of smooth jazz

isn't just the best-selling. instrumentalist of all time.

He's also one of the. most critically reviled

musicians in history.

And he's the subject of. the new HBO documentary,

"Listening to Kenny G,". which The New Yorker called

an ironic masterpiece. that perfectly defines

In "Listening to Kenny. G," director Penny Lane

explores why critics hate Kenny. G and the masses love him,

creating a funny poignant. and entrancing conversation

about mass commercial. appeal and elite tastes.

When I think about music,

the first thing that comes to mind

is just the idea of taste and. how deeply intimate that is

with our sense of selves and. your sense of social identity.

So I really wanted to. do something about that.

And then getting from that. to Kenny was pretty obvious.

So an exploration of why. Kenny G is the most popular

and successful and best-selling. instrumentalist of all time

and why that success makes

a certain subset of people really mad.

That's a hard lick. I just. played it really well.

Lane gives the critics their due.

To many of them, Kenny G is. offensive because he seems

fundamentally uninterested. in the musical tradition

that he has come to define. for millions of people

around the globe.

I spent a lot of time with Kenny

and it kinda didn't matter. how many different ways

I asked him what he was up to

when he was creating these songs.

He was just like, "I don't know.

It's pretty. I like it."

Most artists have a whole set of things

they're thinking about,. like who your audience is,

and who you're in conversation with,

and what histories you're drawing on.

How are you innovating? How. are you making something new?

Kenny just isn't engaged in that.

And I think it's his utter. lack of interest in jazz.

Kenny G does not know anything about jazz.

So what do the people. like who love Kenny G?

I think the most important thing

is that it's music that is useful.

It's useful in their lives.

I think life is hard and. there's is nothing wrong

with wanting something to relax to

after your 10 hours at. the factory or whatever.

It's useful music because. it doesn't have lyrics.

It doesn't get in the way.

You can put it on in the background.

So people study to it,. they meditate to it.

They run to it. They make love to it.

They get married to it.

They've used it to put babies to sleep.

Anesthesiologists use it before surgery.

It helps get the heart rate down.

The Chinese government. uses it to send people home

at the end of the workday.

It is a supremely functional music,

which is interesting. because it's referred to

by another critic as musical furniture,

which I think is actually pretty apt.

It's easy to forget that most people,

when I tell them that I made a film

about why people hate Kenny G are like

"Who hates Kenny G?

Everyone loves Kenny G!"

Recent interviewed you a few years ago

when your incredible documentary. "Hail Satan?" came out.

That is a film about a group. of Satanists who are pushing

for equal representation. of religious icons

in the public square.

What's the connection there?

The joke way of putting it would be to say

after I made a movie defending Satanists,

I thought to myself

"Who do people hate more than Satanists?"

But that's not really true, of course.

It's more like I am I. think what I'm good at

and what I think what I'm good at

and what I'm trying to. do often with my films

is find really entertaining. funny ways to talk

about really serious. issues that I don't think

a poe-faced delivery would. get a big audience for.

And I want people to be. able to change their minds.

I want people to be willing. to change their minds

and I love that.

I love the feeling of. finding out that I'm wrong.

Not everyone does. I love it.

I'm trying to engineer moments

where it's like destabilizing for people.

I think one of the most. insightful criticisms

is a jazz ensemble is kind. of a call and response thing,

it's equal parts, everybody's. playing against each other,

and that Kenny G, it's just Kenny G.

It's just the saxophone.

Everybody else there is. there to support him.

Yeah, it's a solo-

He says, "It's not sex.. It's masturbation."

The most quoted line in the movie.

But that guy is also

a ridiculous character of a jazz.

Why should jazz have one meaning

that is described by some old white guys

who are really upset that. this Jewish guy from Seattle

is selling so many records

and is like fucking with their little pot.

Yes.

I agree with you that that is. a question the movie raises.

I can see it both ways.

I'm trying to play down the middle.

I'm trying to like lay out

a kind of like banquet. of discussion topics.

Lane's film's all proceed. from the assumption

that she doesn't have all the answers

and that she doesn't know the best way

for other people to live or. the best music to listen to.

It's no coincidence that she's

a longtime reader of Reason magazine.

I started subscribing to. Reason when I was in college

and I went to Vassar.

So it like came in the mail.

I would like put it. underneath all my other mail

to bring it back to my dorm room.

But honestly, in high school,

I remember we had a politics class

and you were supposed to. choose Democrat or Republican

to be part of the debate or whatever.

And I just like didn't like it,

I just didn't know what to do,

'cause I was like, "I. don't want either one."

And my teacher was like,

"Okay, well there's this other thing."

And I think on some level I. probably was attracted to it

because it made me feel special.

I'm the one person here who doesn't wanna

go along with the crowd.

I was like, "Yeah, society. needs people who are annoying,

who stand outside and say,. 'Yeah, but what about this?'"

And I've always identified. with that kind of personality.

And I do think that is somewhat

of a kind of libertarian personality type.

But as far as my etiology. goes in the films,

I think to the extent that. there is etiology there,

it's very much about humility.

I think I'm a genius and. I should run the world,

but I would never wanna do that

because I actually don't. think that my ideas

are better than other people's ideas.

I mean, I think I have ideas. about how I want to live,

but I'm not interested in. imposing them on other people.

I think I would more say. that I'm asking people

usually to consider issues. from different points of view

and to acknowledge that probably. they're going to gravitate

toward one of those.

So you might watch the. Kenny G film and think

the critics are villains.

You might watch the Kenny G and think-

Kenny G is history's greatest monster.

Yes, someone else would. watch it and find him

odious and unacceptable.

I am thrilled to make a film

that allows for those readings.

I really am not trying to tell. people what to think, truly,

but I do think that there are things

that I'm passionate about foregrounding

that I wanna force people to contend with.